Knicks/Bulls In Discussions For Tyrus Thomas
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knickzrulezH20
Sexy Stud
several sources been saying this guy has been wanted by d'antoni for a while. and yes hes a bonehead, but lets not forget where he was drafted. this guy was a 2nd overall pick. he has immense athletic ability. hes a human pogo stick. this deal doesnt affect our cap space, will allow gallo and chandler to take more shots, and gives us a one year shot to try and mold this idiotic but immensely talented underachiever, into something decent or maybe even good. i have no problem with this risk
donchris
Next season, keep waiting
It's no secret that I'm a Harrington fan so needless to say this trade sounds utterly pointless and would only take the Knicks 10 steps backwards if that's even possible. Harrington is the best scorer on the team.
However, if for some odd reason D'Antoni thinks moving Harrington will improve Gallinari I can see the reasoning behind the trade. Although even that wouldn't make sense because Gallo has been starting and getting minutes on the court with out Harrington at times. I don't know. Can't wrap my head around it.
mafra
Legend
I have some thoughts about this trade:
1- Stop talking about Kirk Hinrich. Due is slated to make 9 mil in 2010 & another 8 mil in 2011. He's good but not worth that committment. UNLESS they take Curry back (which they wont) we can't even consider KH,
2- I like Al. I feel he's one of the best 6th man in the NBA, and would be fantastic in that role for a championship caliber team. TOUGH to guard and is big. I think there's a slim chance he stays home and accepts that role in NY if we lured a Lebron.
2a- Harrington is our one, true "chip" currently, so Walsh will deal AL, and I'm sure explain things to him. What does this mean? Well, Donnie will tell AL if he's really willing to return in 2010 at the right price (and wantds to be here when the Knicks turn it around) then it helps the organization if the boomerrang him (trade him for somehting of value that helps NY, and then he returns anyway during the Summer).... ALSO, by dealing AL to a playoff team, Harrington has a better shot to get more money if he proves his worth. This is a win-win for both parties.... NO harm either way.
2b- We shouldn't have to rush this deal. Thomas has a broken arm. ALSO, wait and see what teams get desperate. We should (and could) afford to hold out for the best possible deal. Closer you get to Feb., the more you might be able to get. Unless we get swept off our feets, hold on to AL. Like some said, see if CHI tosses in a draft choice; or is willing to take back JJ.
4- What does it say about Jordan Hill if we trade for Tyrus Thomas? We pass on Jennings & Lawson for Hill, then turn around & trade for another PF? Hill has a sweet jumper, so it appears like he's the better fit for D'ant's system.
4a- NOW, if the thinking is to have Thomas (PF) & Hill (C), then you might have something. Thomas proved in the playoffs last season he is a tough presence in the paint. He plays way above his height b/c of his ups.... Much better defensive player than David Lee. Thomas & Hill could be our Amare & Diaw?
4b- Making this deal means we get the OPTION to retain TT (if we desire) and have as much of a chance to bring Harrington back (as much even if we kept him all season). Just one more possible asset to lure a free agent, or to move fwd w/ a plan-B if we cannot. Dude does change the scenary and brings defense and toughness in the pain (shot blocking) and other stuff we lack. (Gallo-Thomas-Hill could be a fallback plan to build around as our future frontcourt).
5- If we make this trade, we have to go all in. This means getting a Fernandez (along with either Outlaw or Batum) from POR for David Lee. This means finding a taker for Duhon, Hughes or N8.
My dream scenario:
(A) Harrington & a 2nd rounder to CHI for Thomas, James & a 1st rounder.
(B) David Lee for Rudy Fernandez & Travis Outlaw (although Batum or Bayless would be better)
(C) N8 to LAL for Farmar & Powell
* I wont even include trades for Curry (say to DAL or HOU).
BUT...
"Realistically" let's say we get this for Harrington, Lee, Duhon, JJ & N8:
Fernandez (small 2010 committment)
Thomas (we have option to retain if we wish)
Gortat (ouch- but still cheaper in 2010 than JJ)
Redick, Powell, Outlaw (all expiring contracts)
Plus a 1st round selection and we dump Jeffries. Well, it wont happen but I can dream....
We go into 2010 with:
Fernandez (PG)
Chandler (SG)
Gallo (SF)
We can bring back Powell or Thomas to play PF.
We have Hill & Curry for our center.
We have Douglas (plus a 1st & 2nd round draft pick).
Now add Lebron or Joe Johnson + (Bosh or Gay) to this group.
1- Stop talking about Kirk Hinrich. Due is slated to make 9 mil in 2010 & another 8 mil in 2011. He's good but not worth that committment. UNLESS they take Curry back (which they wont) we can't even consider KH,
2- I like Al. I feel he's one of the best 6th man in the NBA, and would be fantastic in that role for a championship caliber team. TOUGH to guard and is big. I think there's a slim chance he stays home and accepts that role in NY if we lured a Lebron.
2a- Harrington is our one, true "chip" currently, so Walsh will deal AL, and I'm sure explain things to him. What does this mean? Well, Donnie will tell AL if he's really willing to return in 2010 at the right price (and wantds to be here when the Knicks turn it around) then it helps the organization if the boomerrang him (trade him for somehting of value that helps NY, and then he returns anyway during the Summer).... ALSO, by dealing AL to a playoff team, Harrington has a better shot to get more money if he proves his worth. This is a win-win for both parties.... NO harm either way.
2b- We shouldn't have to rush this deal. Thomas has a broken arm. ALSO, wait and see what teams get desperate. We should (and could) afford to hold out for the best possible deal. Closer you get to Feb., the more you might be able to get. Unless we get swept off our feets, hold on to AL. Like some said, see if CHI tosses in a draft choice; or is willing to take back JJ.
4- What does it say about Jordan Hill if we trade for Tyrus Thomas? We pass on Jennings & Lawson for Hill, then turn around & trade for another PF? Hill has a sweet jumper, so it appears like he's the better fit for D'ant's system.
4a- NOW, if the thinking is to have Thomas (PF) & Hill (C), then you might have something. Thomas proved in the playoffs last season he is a tough presence in the paint. He plays way above his height b/c of his ups.... Much better defensive player than David Lee. Thomas & Hill could be our Amare & Diaw?
4b- Making this deal means we get the OPTION to retain TT (if we desire) and have as much of a chance to bring Harrington back (as much even if we kept him all season). Just one more possible asset to lure a free agent, or to move fwd w/ a plan-B if we cannot. Dude does change the scenary and brings defense and toughness in the pain (shot blocking) and other stuff we lack. (Gallo-Thomas-Hill could be a fallback plan to build around as our future frontcourt).
5- If we make this trade, we have to go all in. This means getting a Fernandez (along with either Outlaw or Batum) from POR for David Lee. This means finding a taker for Duhon, Hughes or N8.
My dream scenario:
(A) Harrington & a 2nd rounder to CHI for Thomas, James & a 1st rounder.
(B) David Lee for Rudy Fernandez & Travis Outlaw (although Batum or Bayless would be better)
(C) N8 to LAL for Farmar & Powell
* I wont even include trades for Curry (say to DAL or HOU).
BUT...
"Realistically" let's say we get this for Harrington, Lee, Duhon, JJ & N8:
Fernandez (small 2010 committment)
Thomas (we have option to retain if we wish)
Gortat (ouch- but still cheaper in 2010 than JJ)
Redick, Powell, Outlaw (all expiring contracts)
Plus a 1st round selection and we dump Jeffries. Well, it wont happen but I can dream....
We go into 2010 with:
Fernandez (PG)
Chandler (SG)
Gallo (SF)
We can bring back Powell or Thomas to play PF.
We have Hill & Curry for our center.
We have Douglas (plus a 1st & 2nd round draft pick).
Now add Lebron or Joe Johnson + (Bosh or Gay) to this group.
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Why does nobody mention James Johnson in these Bulls trades?
He hasn't played that well so far, but that just means he's low cost. He's a versatile power forward he can shoot the deep ball. Isn't that essentially a younger Al Harrington?
The Bulls clearly prefer Taj Gibson, so whether they end up with Thomas, Harrington, or Lee as their PF, Johnson will be third string. The Bulls also need more cap room if they want a go at a max free agent.
He hasn't played that well so far, but that just means he's low cost. He's a versatile power forward he can shoot the deep ball. Isn't that essentially a younger Al Harrington?
The Bulls clearly prefer Taj Gibson, so whether they end up with Thomas, Harrington, or Lee as their PF, Johnson will be third string. The Bulls also need more cap room if they want a go at a max free agent.
Crazy⑧s
Evacuee
Crazy⑧s
Evacuee
That's Bullshit
That's retarded. $9m+ Just sitting there for a rebuilding team. Gotta wonder how many players we're keeping in that case. What a dismal thought. If we keep Duhon I'll ****ing cry.
That's retarded. $9m+ Just sitting there for a rebuilding team. Gotta wonder how many players we're keeping in that case. What a dismal thought. If we keep Duhon I'll ****ing cry.
BlackH20
Benchwarmer
Stay with this crew now
Stick to pursuing Fernandez and Outlaw from Portland and build toward a future with skill as opposed to raw athleticism.
People are saying Jordan Hill is raw. Tyrus Thomas is in the same class. Potential plus and outstanding athletic ability at close to 7ft. I don't think we need another one of them. Projects aren't reliable and we don't wanna be noted as a team with a penchant for "could be" players.
A big arse post like that deserves a bong.:smokin:
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Thomas improved big time last year and played amazing in the playoffs.
He plays much bigger with his vertical leap, no comparison to Hill, Hill is raw and he is not working too hard on getting better so far, word is he is not putting too much time in on the court before or after practices which is just a must in today's game. Thomas is way better, and a hard worker. I would take that deal any day, but I wouldn't throw another player into this mix now, D'Antonio has got 7-8 players working good together, Gallo was out tonight and they didn't miss him (though he's a keeper, if that back holds up, which is very scary in a kid that young). It's took two months with every mathematical combination of players to get this good and at least compete, these level of trades with second, third tier players aren't going to help the Knicks much, taking a month to 6 weeks learning to play with a different team. If your looking for wins this year, we need an old 7 footer for the paint for 20 minutes.
This is going to be another two to three years to dig out of this mess, but I think there will be a progression of more W's each year. It was good to see Harrington start tonight, what a great half, but he ran out of gas, maybe that is why he comes off the bench, but I think he got the team pumped up. Duhon had is best game of the year also, ppg may be 7 now, maybe over 20 wins this year? Just my opinion, probably wrong.
Stick to pursuing Fernandez and Outlaw from Portland and build toward a future with skill as opposed to raw athleticism.
People are saying Jordan Hill is raw. Tyrus Thomas is in the same class. Potential plus and outstanding athletic ability at close to 7ft. I don't think we need another one of them. Projects aren't reliable and we don't wanna be noted as a team with a penchant for "could be" players.
A big arse post like that deserves a bong.:smokin:
[/SIZE][/SIZE][/FONT][/FONT][/QUOTE]
Thomas improved big time last year and played amazing in the playoffs.
He plays much bigger with his vertical leap, no comparison to Hill, Hill is raw and he is not working too hard on getting better so far, word is he is not putting too much time in on the court before or after practices which is just a must in today's game. Thomas is way better, and a hard worker. I would take that deal any day, but I wouldn't throw another player into this mix now, D'Antonio has got 7-8 players working good together, Gallo was out tonight and they didn't miss him (though he's a keeper, if that back holds up, which is very scary in a kid that young). It's took two months with every mathematical combination of players to get this good and at least compete, these level of trades with second, third tier players aren't going to help the Knicks much, taking a month to 6 weeks learning to play with a different team. If your looking for wins this year, we need an old 7 footer for the paint for 20 minutes.
This is going to be another two to three years to dig out of this mess, but I think there will be a progression of more W's each year. It was good to see Harrington start tonight, what a great half, but he ran out of gas, maybe that is why he comes off the bench, but I think he got the team pumped up. Duhon had is best game of the year also, ppg may be 7 now, maybe over 20 wins this year? Just my opinion, probably wrong.
Crazy⑧s
Evacuee
I didn't understand the vast majority of what you were implying there sorry.
This year as purgatory is not bout cohesion, it's about patience.
If we're going to need mathematical equations to compete, then I can't see how an overhaul upgrade throughout most spots would mathematically hinder that at all?
Again, I don't see where you're going with this?
doesn't justify our record in the slightest. This year is
This year as purgatory is not bout cohesion, it's about patience.
If we're going to need mathematical equations to compete, then I can't see how an overhaul upgrade throughout most spots would mathematically hinder that at all?
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metrocard
Legend
Because we already have enough forwards on this team.
smokes
Huge Member
If Tyrus is thought of as a future player for the Knicks by management you'd have to further question the selection of Jordan Hill.
Harrington is one of the top 20 scorers in the NBA, Tyrus is fine but he's not on Harrington's level. We'd have to get a pick or another piece out of this for it to be worth it.
metrocard
Legend
Is this trade really the best we can do?
Haven't we had enough with Chicago's bust and their overhyped prospects?
Thomas is intriguing.
He's a solid help defender.
1.6 steals per 36 minutes
2.5 blocks per 36 minutes
Over 9 rebounds per 36 minutes
along with 14 points on 3 fouls/2.4 turnovers per game
If he shot a higher % he would average over 16 ppg...sounds like all star numbers.
We kinda need an athletic beast at PF...look at what Shawn Marion did in Phoneix...Thomas can actually emulate Shawn Marion's role and become a beast.
Look at this
Duhon
Hughes
Gallinari
Thomas
Lee
You keep Thomas/Gallinari for the future...with Duhon/Hughes/Lee as replaceable.
Thomas does everything Gallinari is bad at, Gallinari does everything Thomas is bad at...this is the perfect formula.
If we do get Thomas, we have to teach the kid to be more aggressive and how to shoot at a higher FG%
Thomas has a little jumpshot too, and his FT can improve because he shoots at 72% which isn't terrible.
Another trade I would pursue is finally get a PG.
That PG is Jose Juan Barea, dude plays like a tough Steve Nash
Knicks trade
Marcus Landry
Wilson Chandler
2010 2nd round
Dallas trades
Jose Barea
2010 1st round
Dallas
Kidd/Beabois
Howard/Terry
Chandler/Thomas
Marion/Gooden
Dirk/Dampier
NY
Barea/Duhon/Robinson
Hughes/Douglas
Gallinari/Jefferies
Thomas/Hill
Lee/Darko/Curry
Next trade I would do is optain an elite slasher...a 20 ppg + at SG we got scoring in Gallinari and Lee, we need a more dynamic scorer.
Portland trades
Rudy Fernandez
Jared Bayless
Nicolas Batum
Juwan Howard
Dante Cunningham
Knicks trade
Nate Robinson
Wilson Chandler
Marcus Landry
Portland
PG - Miller/Blake
SG - Roy/Robinson
SF - Chandler/Outlaw
PF - Aldridge/Lee
C - Oden/Przybilla
NY
PG - Barea/Duhon/Bayless
SG - Hughes/Fernandez/Douglas
SF - Gallinari/Batum/Cunningham
PF - Thomas/Howard/Hill
C - Lee/Darko/Curry
Next
Get T'Mac's huge expiring and watch him make a comeback
Houston trades
Tracey McGrady
Joey Dorsey
NY trades
Chris Duhon
Eddy Curry
Jared Jefferies
New Knicks
PG - Barea//Bayless
SG - T'Mac/Fernandez/Douglas
SF - Gallinari/Batum/Cunningham
PF - Thomas/Howard/Hill
C - Lee/Darko/Dorsey
But outside of my fantasies....the Knicks have to PURSUE THIS DEAL ONLY WITH CHICAGO.
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5311937
Chicago trades
Jannero Pargo
Joakim Noah
Tyrus Thomas
Jerome James
Brad Miller
New York trades
Eddy Curry
David Lee
Wilson Chandler
Al Harrington
Chicago
Rose/Hinrinch
Salmons/Chandler
Deng/Johnson
Harrington/Gibson
Lee/Curry/Gray
New York
Duhon/Robinson/Pargo
Hughes/Douglas
Gallinari/Jefferies
Thomas/Hill
Noah/Miller/Darko
With that deal, Knicks establish their future frontcourt
Haven't we had enough with Chicago's bust and their overhyped prospects?
Thomas is intriguing.
He's a solid help defender.
1.6 steals per 36 minutes
2.5 blocks per 36 minutes
Over 9 rebounds per 36 minutes
along with 14 points on 3 fouls/2.4 turnovers per game
If he shot a higher % he would average over 16 ppg...sounds like all star numbers.
We kinda need an athletic beast at PF...look at what Shawn Marion did in Phoneix...Thomas can actually emulate Shawn Marion's role and become a beast.
Look at this
Duhon
Hughes
Gallinari
Thomas
Lee
You keep Thomas/Gallinari for the future...with Duhon/Hughes/Lee as replaceable.
Thomas does everything Gallinari is bad at, Gallinari does everything Thomas is bad at...this is the perfect formula.
If we do get Thomas, we have to teach the kid to be more aggressive and how to shoot at a higher FG%
Thomas has a little jumpshot too, and his FT can improve because he shoots at 72% which isn't terrible.
Another trade I would pursue is finally get a PG.
That PG is Jose Juan Barea, dude plays like a tough Steve Nash
Knicks trade
Marcus Landry
Wilson Chandler
2010 2nd round
Dallas trades
Jose Barea
2010 1st round
Dallas
Kidd/Beabois
Howard/Terry
Chandler/Thomas
Marion/Gooden
Dirk/Dampier
NY
Barea/Duhon/Robinson
Hughes/Douglas
Gallinari/Jefferies
Thomas/Hill
Lee/Darko/Curry
Next trade I would do is optain an elite slasher...a 20 ppg + at SG we got scoring in Gallinari and Lee, we need a more dynamic scorer.
Portland trades
Rudy Fernandez
Jared Bayless
Nicolas Batum
Juwan Howard
Dante Cunningham
Knicks trade
Nate Robinson
Wilson Chandler
Marcus Landry
Portland
PG - Miller/Blake
SG - Roy/Robinson
SF - Chandler/Outlaw
PF - Aldridge/Lee
C - Oden/Przybilla
NY
PG - Barea/Duhon/Bayless
SG - Hughes/Fernandez/Douglas
SF - Gallinari/Batum/Cunningham
PF - Thomas/Howard/Hill
C - Lee/Darko/Curry
Next
Get T'Mac's huge expiring and watch him make a comeback
Houston trades
Tracey McGrady
Joey Dorsey
NY trades
Chris Duhon
Eddy Curry
Jared Jefferies
New Knicks
PG - Barea//Bayless
SG - T'Mac/Fernandez/Douglas
SF - Gallinari/Batum/Cunningham
PF - Thomas/Howard/Hill
C - Lee/Darko/Dorsey
But outside of my fantasies....the Knicks have to PURSUE THIS DEAL ONLY WITH CHICAGO.
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5311937
Chicago trades
Jannero Pargo
Joakim Noah
Tyrus Thomas
Jerome James
Brad Miller
New York trades
Eddy Curry
David Lee
Wilson Chandler
Al Harrington
Chicago
Rose/Hinrinch
Salmons/Chandler
Deng/Johnson
Harrington/Gibson
Lee/Curry/Gray
New York
Duhon/Robinson/Pargo
Hughes/Douglas
Gallinari/Jefferies
Thomas/Hill
Noah/Miller/Darko
With that deal, Knicks establish their future frontcourt
ANU
Starter
http://www.theknicksblog.com/2009/12/05/thomas-talk-dead/#comments
looks like this shit is dead.i honestly could not give a **** where these dudes end up.as long as we get some draft picks and or young players so we can make some moves I'm all for it.
looks like this shit is dead.i honestly could not give a **** where these dudes end up.as long as we get some draft picks and or young players so we can make some moves I'm all for it.
It was a good idea....trading offense for defense.
I think if push came to shove i would have made this move. We need defense and Tyrus Thomas is a young player with a defensive talent. Harrington is very good offensively but is still a streak player with inconsistencies. Al can pull the dumbest moves in crunch time to ruin games and has only one year left so trading him can be because of those few reasons. I would not have been mad or overly joyed about the move.
knickzrulezH20
Sexy Stud
just a random thought... if we can get harrington to keep up putting monster numbers, maybe houston would jump and try to get him. harrington+jeffries for mcgrady? i know its a longshot, but getting rid of jeffries has to be our number 1 priority
mafra
Legend
If the Knicks have teams that want ANYTHING we have, we would be stupid not to make deals (I think only Gallo & Douglas are really untouchable).
YEAH, that means even Chandler & Hill could be had for the right deal!
I admire Al Harrington. He's efforting, that is obvious. He has talent and he can score. If he were our 6th man for the next 3 years, I would be on board for that as well.
BUT WE WOULD BE STUPID TO HOL ON TO AL!
All Walsh has to do is explain the situation to AL, and how he loves his game and wants him to be part of our future.... All that stuff, and then trade him. It's best for both parties. We get something of value in return for AL, and he gets to go compete and win somewhere (and try to pump up is earning potential this Summer).
Why lose Al for nada? If he really wants to be here in 2010 (the local boy who wants to be in NY when the team turns it around), then he should demand a trade. Moving him only improves this team going fwd.
HOWEVER, I hold out for the best possible deal. NO WAY I deal AL straight up for TT. Why help CHI? Let them OVERPAY for something (they way they made us do it). Unless they take Jeffries or toss in a 1st rounder, then we hold on to our best chip in AL and see what better deals come along.
Getting Thomas would be fitting (since CHI used our draft pick to select him). I also think if Gallo, Thomas & Hill reach their potential, they compliment each other as a solid front court moving ahead.
YEAH, that means even Chandler & Hill could be had for the right deal!
I admire Al Harrington. He's efforting, that is obvious. He has talent and he can score. If he were our 6th man for the next 3 years, I would be on board for that as well.
BUT WE WOULD BE STUPID TO HOL ON TO AL!
All Walsh has to do is explain the situation to AL, and how he loves his game and wants him to be part of our future.... All that stuff, and then trade him. It's best for both parties. We get something of value in return for AL, and he gets to go compete and win somewhere (and try to pump up is earning potential this Summer).
Why lose Al for nada? If he really wants to be here in 2010 (the local boy who wants to be in NY when the team turns it around), then he should demand a trade. Moving him only improves this team going fwd.
HOWEVER, I hold out for the best possible deal. NO WAY I deal AL straight up for TT. Why help CHI? Let them OVERPAY for something (they way they made us do it). Unless they take Jeffries or toss in a 1st rounder, then we hold on to our best chip in AL and see what better deals come along.
Getting Thomas would be fitting (since CHI used our draft pick to select him). I also think if Gallo, Thomas & Hill reach their potential, they compliment each other as a solid front court moving ahead.