Better Start Looking 4 A New Coach!

[iJoe]

I wish people wouldn't bash or love Dantoni in such an extreme....

Lets look at both sides:

Dantoni in Phoenix was undoubtedly successful. Period. You really can't argue that he coached badly or any other such nonsense. Hell, even Kurt Thomas flourished under him. He had an epic run and was one NBA mass suspension away from being a champion. Robert Horry once again proves the demise of another franchise.

Now... in NYC... Dantoni has not proven he can win yet. He's already proven to be able to win with an ideal cast for his system. What he hasn't proven is whether he can adapt his coaching to fit his players. That will be the sticking point for us in the offseason. If we do manage to nab a speedy pass first point and get a real center, Dantoni may get another chance.

If we can't find an idea cast for Dant's system and he doesn't prove his ability to adapt in this year's playoffs? He's a goner, unless there are no other quality coaches available (Adelman). In which case, he'll get a short one year rental agreement to try to prove himself again.

 

[Red]

Just a quick question for everyone...how many coaches change their system for the players on the roster? Popovic maybe, but not many. Jackson (triangle), Larry Brown (slow methodical defensive), Jerry Sloan (pick and roll), Van Gundy (defensive).

This seems to be more about lack of defensive emphasis rather than system. The notion that the system and defense are mutually exclusive seems false.

It's one in of itself. The ENTIRE approach. His systems and ideal players yield poor defensive results. Yes positive offensive results, but poor defensively.

So when he's tagged with the reputation he has (all offense), how can anyone question or refute this? Its true.

If you say its the players, he picks em'
If you say it worked, to an extent but not really
If you say time is needed, his defensive results span 8 years
If you say its about attitude, that's not entirely true at all
If you say a team can win running his system, yes in a limited way, but was beat by better defensive teams

All Mike has to do is either larn the nuances of defense and understand he has to tweak/scale down, revamp his approach

Or bring in an assistant, which will take an adjustment of his approach

Or understand, we don't need this 106pts per, and we can find someone more suited

Either way, just as a player is never put above the team, neither will he be.

 

[knicksin60]

I think Big Bird would be a real viable option to replace D'antoni.

 

[ronoranina]

I don't understand the Doc Rivers love either? I know he spent two mediocre years as a knick, but he was really an atlanta guy before he started coaching the celtics.

He's a defensive minded guy and likes to focus on that side of the ball, so i guess that is where you base your love, on coaching philosophy. But why would doc leave the celtics? If we were talking about unrealistic coaches we would love to have here, well I'd MUCH rather have a guy like Gregg Popovich, a balanced and fair coach that has always had his team near the top of the league defensively AND offensively.


But I digress... I don't see any writing on the wall about D'antoni leaving. If the knicks get to the playoffs and have even a glimmer of success, play hard against opponents, take a game or two, then he will be back next year. And after the off season, when we can mold the roster a little better, This team is going to come out poised to end up top 4 in the east. We will have home court advantage through the playoffs, we should win our first series since '99.

This upward trend should only continue, barring injury to our players. We can probably make ECF's next year and a few years following, if not better. As long as there is still progress and the team is getting better, I don't see how Walsh and Dolan can justify getting rid of D'antoni. It would mean bringing in a new coaching staff, adjusting the roster in significant ways, and basically throwing out a lot of the work that Donnie has done over the past 3 years.

And I do not see anything wrong with this. I know that you RED feel that the knicks will not win a championship with MDA's system in place. However it has been over 10 years since the knicks have seen real playoff success, if D'antoni can deliver success in the playoffs, improving on each season as we move towards our goal of a 'chip, then there is no way that he will be fired.

The only way D'antoni will be fired is if we have a total collapse on this team, the players scream bloody mutiny and donnie walsh dies. Thats pretty much it. You can save your time with this remove D'antoni stuff, becuase I don't see it happening. Not that it wouldn't be good for the team to remove him right now and replace him with a Gregg Pops/Jerry Sloan type of guy, just that it is practically impossible for D'ant to lose his job.



...Then again I never thought I would see Gallo traded either, so what do I know. that was for Melo tho. So I guess if Phil Jackson wanted to come coach the knicks it could happen...

I agree w pretty much all of this. All MDA has to do is get us in the playoffs and he's back next year. So simple. I'd be shocked if he got fired unless the team just gave no effort in the first round. But I don't see that happening. The players, in all likelihood will be psyched to have a Knicks team in the playoffs for the first time in a while and also eager to prove they won't be an easy out.

Next season we'll be a tough team nobody will want to face. I'd like to see us make a jump in defensive effeciency from 28th, where we are now, to 15th at minimum - ideally at 12th -10th. A team that can play defense that efficiently (12th- 10th) coupled w MDA's offense can contend w anyone in my estimation.

 

[nyk_nyk]

Even though I'm not a Dantoni fan, I can't totally blame him for everything. Some things are left up to the players like internal fight and the will to win BUT what the team lacks is a framework for that. Players usually display that defensive intensity because they understand that’s the identity of the team. The problem I have with MDA is he created an atmosphere where its more important to score rather than clamp down and use a good portion of your energy on defense. This is why he's called a players coach and while that sounds great it has a negative affect. I'd rather my players like me because I do whatever is neccesary to win-- not because I let them showcase their skills and in the process boost stats. I'm not saying MDA is anti-defense but its definitely subordinate to scoring.

Douglas is a fine player and will be even better next year but he's not learning how to play with more talented players around him. He basically has the green light to shoot even if Melo nor Amare have yet to touch the ball (something Nate would get benched for). Becaue MDA promotes free shooting from everyone, you don't get a sense who the main guys are at times. Some of you may argue that its better that way as it promotes team effort. I'll argue that it promotes inconsistency. Players should know what their role is and perform accordingly. Too many times Douglas or Williams have about as much shot attempts as Melo or Amare.
　
Dantoni doesn't seem to know how to utilize certain types of players either (which is weird for a head coach). Randolph's upside is clearly rebounding and defense yet MDA failed to get that out of him consistently. I believe Gallo had more than enough chances to succeed which makes it all the more confusing. I don't know what AR had to do to play but clearly all MDA had to do was have him focus on defense and rebounding (which he's already good at). The truth is MDA didn't like his style of play so he benched him in favor of 3 pt shooter Williams. Sure AR looked lost at times but a player will improve if shown confidence and he's not worried about being exiled to the bench again. This is why TD plays well, because he knows he has the support of coach.
　
MDA gave Bender plenty of minutes so he could shoot 3s (WTF?) but gave defensive players like Darko and AR hell. MDA's philosohpy is entertaining and dangerous only on good shooting nights but its mostly inconsistent and doesn't have the defense to fall back on during off nights.
　
Dantoni can go coach GS and let us have a more traditional style coach. This is NY where we care about ALL aspects of the game.

 

[WrongIslander]

I think he's on borrowed time. He's even getting quizzed by MSG reporters now, that can't be a good sign. Oh and while we are at it what the hell is he doing arguing with fans about his decisions in the 4th quarter?

Coach K for me if he does go.

 

[p0nder]

Except d'antoni won't go to GS. he'll be here for another 3-5 years at minimum barring a complete collapse, we miss the playoffs and the players mutiny.

Face it folks, you can cry and whine about how dantoni's a bad coach all you want but you will be forced to bear witness to either his undoing or his exaltation.

Also Doc rivers is a shitty coach. he is defensive minded, he's just not all that smart, so he brought in tom thib's. he was a defensive player and a coach, that goes back to atlanta, through his days as a knick, to his coaching of orlando and boston pre-2007. There are at least 5-10 coaches i would rather have then doc. Doc isn't particularly good at anything aside from managing star players ego's. Parading him around like some kind of genius means you don't comprehend that he is a limited coach who simply thrives of his successful, stacked teams. (sound familiar?)

 

[knicksman20]

Even though I'm not a Dantoni fan, I can't totally blame him for everything. Some things are left up to the players like internal fight and the will to win BUT what the team lacks is a framework for that. Players usually display that defensive intensity because they understand that?s the identity of the team. The problem I have with MDA is he created an atmosphere where its more important to score rather than clamp down and use a good portion of your energy on defense. This is why he's called a players coach and while that sounds great it has a negative affect. I'd rather my players like me because I do whatever is neccesary to win-- not because I let them showcase their skills and in the process boost stats. I'm not saying MDA is anti-defense but its definitely subordinate to scoring.

Douglas is a fine player and will be even better next year but he's not learning how to play with more talented players around him. He basically has the green light to shoot even if Melo nor Amare have yet to touch the ball (something Nate would get benched for). Becaue MDA promotes free shooting from everyone, you don't get a sense who the main guys are at times. Some of you may argue that its better that way as it promotes team effort. I'll argue that it promotes inconsistency. Players should know what their role is and perform accordingly. Too many times Douglas or Williams have about as much shot attempts as Melo or Amare.
　
Dantoni doesn't seem to know how to utilize certain types of players either (which is weird for a head coach). Randolph's upside is clearly rebounding and defense yet MDA failed to get that out of him consistently. I believe Gallo had more than enough chances to succeed which makes it all the more confusing. I don't know what AR had to do to play but clearly all MDA had to do was have him focus on defense and rebounding (which he's already good at). The truth is MDA didn't like his style of play so he benched him in favor of 3 pt shooter Williams. Sure AR looked lost at times but a player will improve if shown confidence and he's not worried about being exiled to the bench again. This is why TD plays well, because he knows he has the support of coach.
　
MDA gave Bender plenty of minutes so he could shoot 3s (WTF?) but gave defensive players like Darko and AR hell. MDA's philosohpy is entertaining and dangerous only on good shooting nights but its mostly inconsistent and doesn't have the defense to fall back on during off nights.
　
Dantoni can go coach GS and let us have a more traditional style coach. This is NY where we care about ALL aspects of the game.

Good objective post! This is why I like Jerry Sloan. He commands respect & can coach BOTH sides of the floor. I hope the Knicks make a pitch to him over the summer (even though I think it's more likely he's going back to Utah next season). He also hold his players accountable & on his squad players KNOW their role. With the players we have now, this team could flourish offensively (and we'll add more pieces next season) & defensively.

 

[Red]

Mike D'Antoni says he's open to the idea of adding a defensive assistant today on ESPN Michael Kay Show!

I feel good about that.

 

[oshi]

Right now I think there's like a 60% chance he stays/40% he goes, how he finishes the year matters. Do I want him to go no matter what? Yes

 

[PaPZ187]

I dont know what the Knicks will do in terms of keeping or firing MDA, but I know I want him gone regardless!!!

Watching the Nets game, they scored a season high 36 in the 1st quarter......WTF YOU CANT WIN WITHOUT DEFENSE!!!!!!