Shawne Williams can JJ be far behind. I hope the Knicks can upgrade the talent next year rather than take on guys like Williams and Jeffries.
Shawne Williams vs. Novak
- Thread starter New New York
- Start date
We all know FA Kenyon Martin & FA Copeland are a must resign this offseason.
Will we resign both?
How long after July 1st. will it take Grunwald to resign K-Mart & Copeland?
As for our 6th-man of the year FF..em we damn sure dont need him next season, we gave him the same super-star greenlight-special on offense as Lebron, Durant, D.Wade, Westbrook, Pierce, Parker, Harding, and Steph Curry had this season, and all he did was dribble dribble dribble to shoot 15 to 18 jumpshots per game at 39%, going to the foul line every other game, plus his selfishness of 2 dimes per never gelled with any teammate on either side of the court.
The 2012-13 6th-man of the year had to be the worst in NBA history if the two top candidates are no-defense, no inside scoring, dribble-dribble jumpshot only Crawful & JR.smith...
Will we resign both?
How long after July 1st. will it take Grunwald to resign K-Mart & Copeland?
As for our 6th-man of the year FF..em we damn sure dont need him next season, we gave him the same super-star greenlight-special on offense as Lebron, Durant, D.Wade, Westbrook, Pierce, Parker, Harding, and Steph Curry had this season, and all he did was dribble dribble dribble to shoot 15 to 18 jumpshots per game at 39%, going to the foul line every other game, plus his selfishness of 2 dimes per never gelled with any teammate on either side of the court.
The 2012-13 6th-man of the year had to be the worst in NBA history if the two top candidates are no-defense, no inside scoring, dribble-dribble jumpshot only Crawful & JR.smith...
knicksince 93
Rotation player
are u saying we needed cope more the jr smith???or k mart more then jr smith??? funny thing is cope had no defense or inside scoring either
TheScowl
Rookie
Those are good questions. Right now I'd have to say the default starting 5 is Melo, Amare, Ty, Shump and Ray. Bench is Prigs, Cope and KMart (and I guess Camby - I think he got a 2 year deal).
Questionable re-signs: JR and Novak. I think by now we know what these guys can and cannot do. Can we do better?
Real NY Baller
Starter
I don't really like neither, but if I had to choose it would be "Williams". Only because he brings a little bit more to the table. Novak had one good year with us and sucked extremely hard this year, and don't forget that 3pt all star weekend contest. He's very limited and when he isn't on you almost want to cry watching him out there. His services can be replaced easily.
New New York
Quiet Storm
Bingo! For the right price both JR and Novak are valuable...Novak and his agent pimped The Knicks! aside from Amare he stands as our most difficult player to move and he still has a few more years on his deal; I mean even Camby has a nice buyout that basically makes his deal expiring this year.
So, my biggest concern is we pay too much for JR and he is a player bound to our team for better or worst.
On a good day Smith is a 10 million dollar a year player...on a bad day he's minimum wadge, how do you gauge his market value? His agent wants The Knicks to think of the good times, yet sadly for him was not the last thing we saw out of him!
If we give him 5 million or more (not sure if thats even possible under new CBA) then it can't be guaranteed for more than 2 years....he and his agent may scoff at this, yet I dare them to find something better!
What scares me is he and Woody's relationship and Woody's loyalty to him, while commendable, it does not make smart business all the time.
We played Lin smart and Novak dead wrong (I suppose that's better than vice versa) but we simply can't afford mistakes with salaries because they cripple us in the off season. I liken them to TO's and Offensive rebounds given up.
metrocard
Legend
Williams had one average NBA season and the rest were terrible. He's not NBA material. Neither is Quincy Douby. I don't know if the Knicks are taking this NBA Title hunt seriously because they're wasting time with E level talented players.
A level = LeBron/CP3/Durant/Melo
B level = George/Gasol/Horford/Curry
C+ level = Rubio/Shumpert/MKG/Sanders
C level = Felton/Redick/Delfino/Okafor
D+ level = Shved/Young/Evans/Anderson
D level = Novak, Haddadi, Anthony Carter...
Williams and Douby don't even qualify for D level guys...why are we downgrading? Chris Smith competes with these bums.
A level = LeBron/CP3/Durant/Melo
B level = George/Gasol/Horford/Curry
C+ level = Rubio/Shumpert/MKG/Sanders
C level = Felton/Redick/Delfino/Okafor
D+ level = Shved/Young/Evans/Anderson
D level = Novak, Haddadi, Anthony Carter...
Williams and Douby don't even qualify for D level guys...why are we downgrading? Chris Smith competes with these bums.
New New York
Quiet Storm
Shump is definetly better than C+...albeit not currently the A quality most Knick fans have him at now, but for sure higher than a C+ just off his D alone....but we'll save that for another friendly Knick debate...now to the issue at hand!
"WHY NOT" IS THE NAME OF THE GAME!!!!!!
Frankly we can't afford top tier talent, so we need to try to turn something out of nothing. This is what the new CBA has forced teams like us who are over the cap to revert to!
Look both Prigioni and Copeland would have made your below D level list before last season and they became C players (if you will) so that's what we have to do!
Rookies and cheap Free Agents are at a all time high in terms of demands.
Look if Williams or Douby (however you spell dudes name) were worth anything then they would not be working out for us but rather would be preparing negotiating deals July 1st....expect workouts from more lowly players in the coming months
Gotta find that diamond in the rough!
Bulls fans probably did not think much of Nate Robinson signing yet he was a difference maker
Spurs fans probably thought of Danny Green as just a filler
Eddy Curry got an audition with San Antonio when we all knew that Ernie Johnson had more of a chance to make the team, but as a GM you gotta give it a shot even though Greg Popovich and Eddy Curry would mix like a broke dude and a gold digger!
What's the worst that happens? Williams gets an invite to camp maybe a non-guaranteed minimum deal and is either waived or cut before season starts... absolute best case he gives us what he did under Dantoni; solid 3 pt shooting and sound D...
Look Earl Barron seems to always be on our team's radar despite never giving us anything relevant, Williams at least was a factor in getting us back to the playoffs, so why not!
metrocard
Legend
Shumpert will be a B level player soon, but right now let's be realistic. He only has 80 NBA under his belt and is coming into form. Shumpert is easily C+, with his potential being B or even maybe B+ level.
The idea of us being unable to afford top tier talent doesn't mean we have to acquire the lowest talent available in the NBA.
Loser mentality right there.
There are guys like Aaron Brooks and Francisco Garcia who are free agents and will look for a roster spot, both guys superior to Douby and Williams.
The CBA doesn't force us to sign scrubs. Every season in the NBA there are always free agents available. There are only 15 roster spots on an NBA team, a lot of those spots will be taken by new rookies entering the league. The pool of talent is always quality and theres no EXCUSE to sign a guy like Douby or Shawne Williams who have no business being in the NBA. Douby hasn't been in the NBA since 2008 and he was a scrub back then. A 3pt specialist who shoots 31%. He's the worst.
He went nut in China and all of a sudden he deserves to take Jason Kidd's spot? That's a joke. We don't have enough PASSERS and Ball distributors on this roster to have Douby play. Too many guys fighting for the ball. Douby is a 6"1 SG in reality with limited PG skills and inability to run an offense. At least Nate Robinson can distribute the ball.
Melo - scorer
Smith - scorer
Amare - scorer
Chandler - can't pass the ball even if his life was on the line
Shumpert - solid passer, but more a scorer
Copeland - scorer
Prigioni is the only guy on this team who's pass oriented.
How does Douby fit? Do you ever think before you post?
Nate Robinson has always been a player, the Rose injury showcased what Robinson has always done when he gets 30 minutes of time.
If you follow NBA scouting, Danny Green has always been a good player especially defensively. Him moving around from Cleveland to San Antonio is just bad management by the Cavs. Danny Green is one of LeBron's favorite players. Comparing them to NBA scrubs and journey men just makes you really stupid.
The idea of us being unable to afford top tier talent doesn't mean we have to acquire the lowest talent available in the NBA.
Loser mentality right there.
There are guys like Aaron Brooks and Francisco Garcia who are free agents and will look for a roster spot, both guys superior to Douby and Williams.
The CBA doesn't force us to sign scrubs. Every season in the NBA there are always free agents available. There are only 15 roster spots on an NBA team, a lot of those spots will be taken by new rookies entering the league. The pool of talent is always quality and theres no EXCUSE to sign a guy like Douby or Shawne Williams who have no business being in the NBA. Douby hasn't been in the NBA since 2008 and he was a scrub back then. A 3pt specialist who shoots 31%. He's the worst.
He went nut in China and all of a sudden he deserves to take Jason Kidd's spot? That's a joke. We don't have enough PASSERS and Ball distributors on this roster to have Douby play. Too many guys fighting for the ball. Douby is a 6"1 SG in reality with limited PG skills and inability to run an offense. At least Nate Robinson can distribute the ball.
Melo - scorer
Smith - scorer
Amare - scorer
Chandler - can't pass the ball even if his life was on the line
Shumpert - solid passer, but more a scorer
Copeland - scorer
Prigioni is the only guy on this team who's pass oriented.
How does Douby fit? Do you ever think before you post?
Nate Robinson has always been a player, the Rose injury showcased what Robinson has always done when he gets 30 minutes of time.
If you follow NBA scouting, Danny Green has always been a good player especially defensively. Him moving around from Cleveland to San Antonio is just bad management by the Cavs. Danny Green is one of LeBron's favorite players. Comparing them to NBA scrubs and journey men just makes you really stupid.
metrocard
Legend
Not every player is a diamond in the rough...I really hate when fans think any random Joe can come in and become Jeremy Lin. Douby and Williams already showed what they're capable of in the NBA and over seas and it isn't much. Guys like Lin, Robinson, Green always had production, skill and talent. It was just a matter of putting them in the right situation.
New New York
Quiet Storm
I guess just you Metro! LOL
Look, you are getting way too worked up over this, all The Knicks are doing is working players out, they have not signed anyone yet, so chill!!!
The Spurs signed T Mac and what the hell had he done recently?
What's illogical is to simply say "a player is a scrub and he is not worth looking at" that's simply stupid when you have limited resources to sign players, you gotta work every possible angle and hope to get lucky!
The Heat will work out players you call "scrubs" as will the rest of the league luxury tax paying teams...why, because they are over the cap and are trying to land a rotation player on the cheap
Again its illogical to think we can't even work guys out.
In all likelihood neither are Knicks but why the hell are you getting your panties all balled up over us even taking a look?
Look when we first signed Shawne Williams posters were saying the same things you are right now, then it worked out!
Not looking for another Lin situation, just a player who can contribute; you see things too black and white.
No one -and I mean no one- on this site thought Pablo would do anything for us and look how that worked..
if working out Williams and Douby was the sum of our Free Agent searches then I would be pissed; but this is just one more method to try to find players, just like Summer League players who will never play, (one more time) you have to bring them in to just see what they have to offer!
Also...you did predict James White would be an impact player for us last year and doubted Felton would be any good for us, so maybe you need to humble yourself in regards to your assessment of NBA talent!
You predicted that not drafting OJ Mayo would set us back years and Bizmack Biyombo was Shawn Kemp with D...so yeah... yet you post with logic?
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metrocard
Legend
Williams was a gimmick player for D'Antoni. He eventually got cold and ended up being a 15 man again then out of the league.
I ain't chilling.
Knicks are working out the wrong players.
T'Mac is at the end of his career and has nothing to do with this. Spurs are the best organization in the NBA, 90% of their signings are always a success and fit their team. They've run the same formula of role players and have been successful at it. Knicks, not so much.
You're saying logic is stupid, but hoping to get lucky isn't? Scouting isn't about luck. It's understanding of what an athlete brings to the table. Work ethic, energy, chemistry with teammates, communication with the coaches, determination to seek maximal improvement in all areas. It isn't luck, numb nuts. It's called research and good scouting.
Chris Anderson is actually a good player. but the Heat have LeBron James so it doesn't matter what they do, they will always succeed. We don't have a top 3 team in the East right now, we need to seek improvement and wasting time with E level scrubs like Williams and Douby isn't doing the job. Why that so hard for you to understand?
I never said we can't work guys out, you're a dumbass for making things up now. Working guys out is part of the plan, it's just about working the RIGHT guys out. An organization is represented by the caliber of players they present to their franchise. Shawne Williams and Douby are garbage.
Explain in full detail how Quincy Douby the Hatian American version of a 36 year old Mike Bibby and Shawne Williams sipping on some sizzurp can help the New York Knicks? How many minutes given you think they can be productive and help the Knicks become better than the Pacers, Heat, Bulls and Nets? Try your best.
No one on this site thought Pablo Prigioni would do anything for us? Yea, only dumbasses like you don't research basketball outside the NBA. Pablo Prigioni has been an impact PG on the international level for 12+ years for the Spanish league and FIBA for Argentina. I made a thread on here before Pablo even played a preseason game explaining why he was such a great signing and Pablo ended up being the started guard for the Knicks and the best defensive and passing guard on the roster.
Bringing up Pablo just totally killed anything you was mentioning and just made me look like a king.
OJ Mayo is an underrated guard who can drop 20 and 5 and play good defense. Knicks passed up on too much talent in these recent drafts and it has hurt us from becoming the best team we can be.
His name is Bismack, not Bizmack, numbnuts. He's only 20 years old and has a lot of room for improvement. We'll see how he develops before we become dumbasses like yourself assessing an NBA player's career based on 150 games. Jackass. Don't even type the word logic, you present none and your post on just based on "why not" and "luck". You lack a critical mind and you're clownish your ideas.
I ain't chilling.
Knicks are working out the wrong players.
T'Mac is at the end of his career and has nothing to do with this. Spurs are the best organization in the NBA, 90% of their signings are always a success and fit their team. They've run the same formula of role players and have been successful at it. Knicks, not so much.
You're saying logic is stupid, but hoping to get lucky isn't? Scouting isn't about luck. It's understanding of what an athlete brings to the table. Work ethic, energy, chemistry with teammates, communication with the coaches, determination to seek maximal improvement in all areas. It isn't luck, numb nuts. It's called research and good scouting.
Chris Anderson is actually a good player. but the Heat have LeBron James so it doesn't matter what they do, they will always succeed. We don't have a top 3 team in the East right now, we need to seek improvement and wasting time with E level scrubs like Williams and Douby isn't doing the job. Why that so hard for you to understand?
I never said we can't work guys out, you're a dumbass for making things up now. Working guys out is part of the plan, it's just about working the RIGHT guys out. An organization is represented by the caliber of players they present to their franchise. Shawne Williams and Douby are garbage.
Explain in full detail how Quincy Douby the Hatian American version of a 36 year old Mike Bibby and Shawne Williams sipping on some sizzurp can help the New York Knicks? How many minutes given you think they can be productive and help the Knicks become better than the Pacers, Heat, Bulls and Nets? Try your best.
No one on this site thought Pablo Prigioni would do anything for us? Yea, only dumbasses like you don't research basketball outside the NBA. Pablo Prigioni has been an impact PG on the international level for 12+ years for the Spanish league and FIBA for Argentina. I made a thread on here before Pablo even played a preseason game explaining why he was such a great signing and Pablo ended up being the started guard for the Knicks and the best defensive and passing guard on the roster.
Bringing up Pablo just totally killed anything you was mentioning and just made me look like a king.
OJ Mayo is an underrated guard who can drop 20 and 5 and play good defense. Knicks passed up on too much talent in these recent drafts and it has hurt us from becoming the best team we can be.
His name is Bismack, not Bizmack, numbnuts. He's only 20 years old and has a lot of room for improvement. We'll see how he develops before we become dumbasses like yourself assessing an NBA player's career based on 150 games. Jackass. Don't even type the word logic, you present none and your post on just based on "why not" and "luck". You lack a critical mind and you're clownish your ideas.
New New York
Quiet Storm
Is your feelings hurt cause it took me 2 weeks to reply to your friend request, I said yes because I felt sorry for you, I thought I was being nice...then you go and get all emotional!
Look man, I know this childish name calling Internet tough guy talk is your thing but its not mine..I'm sorry I know you spent 2 very energized hours on your reply (sadly) but I've given you enough attention today! Go away!
metrocard
Legend
What friend request? You're a lame. I'm above you.
You obviously got too gased up, everyone on this forum got a friend request from me. Your heart probably dropped like a bitch in reaction to it.
I call you what I want, because you're soft. It's not being a tough guy, you're soft so you make everyone look tough.
The reply took 8 minutes. I did it right after I got home from boxing and checked my emails and saw your lame post.
You're such a lame poster you can't even hold down your own agrument.
If you really was supporting the Quincy Douby invitation you would of posted this video to help your argument.
But instead you opted out to be a stupid *twat and show how low of a quality poster you are in providing information. I honestly saw the argument from both sides but wanted to pick on you because I know you don't provide evidence or facts. You're soft and fruity. Basketball discussion isn't your thing. Leave it to the best. You're still an amateur on this site.
gmf1369
Benchwarmer
Shawne Williams does have a better skill set than Steve Novak but neither are worthy to play with this team... Steve Novak being a pure shooter at this point is more of a trade chip than a rotation piece on our roster... Williams was a product of D'Antoni's system just like Jeremy Lin, could either be productive with this group -- maybe, but doubtful...
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New New York
Quiet Storm
I know I said I'd stop but man you're too funny!
First off say you're a"pro poster" and I merely just an "amateur" explain to me the benefit of one vs the other! Clearly this is the only place in life you matter because of the stock you out in your status here
But since poster status means so much to you please explain to me tough guy how I have half as many rep points as you and you posted more than 7000 more times than me? I'm certain you'll put some spin on it so I can't wait to hear!
Lastly I've given more support to Williams than Douby yet you keep bringing this dude up over and over like I want him signed, I unlike you am not going to get too worked over us working out a player, that's my whole point ..I'll tell you what, show your video to Woody and Grunwald maybe they'll realize how smart a talent scout you are as well as quality poster and give you a job!!! LOL
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Crazy⑧s
Evacuee
Its funny to watch someone smart, New New York, take on an emotional lady like Herpes Baby.
You got nothin to prove, NNY.
metrocard
Legend
You said nothing.
Congrats on your rep points, too bad it doesn't translate to your sex life.
You haven't said anything worth reading about Williams or Douby...I actually had to help you that's why I posted the video.
metrocard
Legend
Crazy⑧s;272751 said:
It's funny the end of your KO.com existance was 60% of you crying like a little owned biatch, threatening rady that you were leaving if my moderator powers weren't removed...saying a meaningless farewell TWICE, but yet still coming back to the forum showing your hurt feelings twice a month towards me.
Not only you're weak physically, you're the weakest man in this forum mentality. You giving pep talk to NNY is like you giving me boxing advice. You're not mentally stable to give advice. The entire forum saw you have a nervous breakdown and expose yourself.
Go pick your chin up, stop coming to this forum all depressed, gloomy with low confidence.