Knicks4lyfe
Starter
I am going to respond to the ten questions in individual posts. FYI.
Christianity in 30 Seconds
- Thread starter KnicksFan4Realz
- Start date
TunerAddict
Starter
Nice job twisting something I said before, clarified in response to your mockery, and further proving everyones point that you never deal with the issue presented and simply veer off onto something different or change what was said to favor yourself.
Funny. You've just proven your own weakness. Explains why you believe in a magical space daddy. Religion is a crutch for the weak, and that is you.
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
You're not trying to add to the productive conversation here. Whenever you post it's to tell me how stupid, or arrogant or ignorant I and those who believe like me.
I respond that way because maybe strong minded people think real life could be the matrix.
Abcd
Jehovah's Witness is known to twist the word of the Lord, so im glad you observed that. ABCD, if you have a serious question concerning the Bible, let me know.
Jehovah's Witness is known to twist the word of the Lord, so im glad you observed that. ABCD, if you have a serious question concerning the Bible, let me know.
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
First question was on miraculous healing that religions claim goes on. Not true.
Is miraculous healing in our day done by means of the spirit of God?
Can the ability to perform miracles come from a source other than the true God?Moses and Aaron appeared before Pharaoh of Egypt to request that Israel be allowed to go into the wilderness to offer sacrifices to Jehovah. As evidence of divine backing, Moses directed Aaron to throw down his rod and it became a big snake. That miracle was done by God?s power. But then the magic-practicing priests of Egypt threw down their rods and these, too, became big snakes. (Ex. 7:8-12) By whose power did they perform their miracle??Compare Deuteronomy 18:10-12.
In the 20th century some faith healing is performed in services conducted by the clergy of Christendom. Among non-Christian religions there are voodoo priests, witch doctors, medicine men, and others who also do healing; they often employ magic and divination. Some "psychic healers" say that their cures have nothing to do with religion. In all these instances, does the healing power come from the true God?
Matt. 24:24: "False Christs and false prophets will arise and will give great signs ["miracles," TEV] and wonders so as to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones."
Matt. 7:15-23: "Be on the watch for the false prophets . . . Many will say to me in that day, ?Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works ["miracles," JB, NE, TEV] in your name?? And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness."
Are the sensational cures of our day performed in the same way as the miraculous cures of Jesus and his early disciples?
Cost of services: "Cure sick people, raise up dead persons, make lepers clean, expel demons. You received free, give free." (Matt. 10:8) (Are healers today doing that?giving free, as Jesus commanded?)
Rate of success: "All the crowd were seeking to touch him [Jesus], because power was going out of him and healing them all." (Luke 6:19) "They brought the sick out even into the broad ways and laid them there upon little beds and cots, in order that, as Peter would go by, at least his shadow might fall upon some one of them. Also, the multitude from the cities around Jerusalem kept coming together, bearing sick people and those troubled with unclean spirits, and they would one and all be cured." (Acts 5:15, 16) (In our day, do all who go to religious practitioners or to religious shrines seeking a cure get healed?)
Does the way of life of members of the organizations of which "healers" are a part give evidence that they have God?s spirit?
As a group do they outstandingly manifest such fruits of the spirit as love, long-suffering, mildness, and self-control??Gal. 5:22, 23.
Can the ability to perform miracles come from a source other than the true God?Moses and Aaron appeared before Pharaoh of Egypt to request that Israel be allowed to go into the wilderness to offer sacrifices to Jehovah. As evidence of divine backing, Moses directed Aaron to throw down his rod and it became a big snake. That miracle was done by God?s power. But then the magic-practicing priests of Egypt threw down their rods and these, too, became big snakes. (Ex. 7:8-12) By whose power did they perform their miracle??Compare Deuteronomy 18:10-12.
In the 20th century some faith healing is performed in services conducted by the clergy of Christendom. Among non-Christian religions there are voodoo priests, witch doctors, medicine men, and others who also do healing; they often employ magic and divination. Some "psychic healers" say that their cures have nothing to do with religion. In all these instances, does the healing power come from the true God?
Matt. 24:24: "False Christs and false prophets will arise and will give great signs ["miracles," TEV] and wonders so as to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones."
Matt. 7:15-23: "Be on the watch for the false prophets . . . Many will say to me in that day, ?Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works ["miracles," JB, NE, TEV] in your name?? And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness."
Are the sensational cures of our day performed in the same way as the miraculous cures of Jesus and his early disciples?
Cost of services: "Cure sick people, raise up dead persons, make lepers clean, expel demons. You received free, give free." (Matt. 10:8) (Are healers today doing that?giving free, as Jesus commanded?)
Rate of success: "All the crowd were seeking to touch him [Jesus], because power was going out of him and healing them all." (Luke 6:19) "They brought the sick out even into the broad ways and laid them there upon little beds and cots, in order that, as Peter would go by, at least his shadow might fall upon some one of them. Also, the multitude from the cities around Jerusalem kept coming together, bearing sick people and those troubled with unclean spirits, and they would one and all be cured." (Acts 5:15, 16) (In our day, do all who go to religious practitioners or to religious shrines seeking a cure get healed?)
Does the way of life of members of the organizations of which "healers" are a part give evidence that they have God?s spirit?
As a group do they outstandingly manifest such fruits of the spirit as love, long-suffering, mildness, and self-control??Gal. 5:22, 23.
Are they truly "no part of the world," shunning all involvement in the world?s political affairs? Have they remained clean of bloodguilt during wartime? Do they have a fine reputation because of avoiding the world?s immoral conduct??John 17:16; Isa. 2:4; 1 Thess. 4:3-8.
Are true Christians today identified by the ability to do miraculous healing?
John 13:35: "By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves." (This is what Jesus said. If we really believe him, we look for love, not miraculous healing, as evidence of true Christianity.)
Acts 1:8: "You will receive power when the holy spirit arrives upon you, and you will be witnesses of me . . . to the most distant part of the earth." (Just before leaving his apostles to return to heaven, Jesus told them that this, not healing, was the vital work they were to do. See also Matthew 24:14; 28:19, 20.)
1 Cor. 12:28-30: "God has set the respective ones in the congregation, first, apostles; second, prophets; third, teachers; then powerful works; then gifts of healings; helpful services, abilities to direct, different tongues. Not all are apostles, are they? Not all are prophets, are they? Not all are teachers, are they? Not all perform powerful works, do they? Not all have gifts of healings, do they?" (So, the Bible clearly shows that not all true Christians would have the gift of healing.)
Acts 1:8: "You will receive power when the holy spirit arrives upon you, and you will be witnesses of me . . . to the most distant part of the earth." (Just before leaving his apostles to return to heaven, Jesus told them that this, not healing, was the vital work they were to do. See also Matthew 24:14; 28:19, 20.)
1 Cor. 12:28-30: "God has set the respective ones in the congregation, first, apostles; second, prophets; third, teachers; then powerful works; then gifts of healings; helpful services, abilities to direct, different tongues. Not all are apostles, are they? Not all are prophets, are they? Not all are teachers, are they? Not all perform powerful works, do they? Not all have gifts of healings, do they?" (So, the Bible clearly shows that not all true Christians would have the gift of healing.)
Does not Mark 16:17, 18 show that ability to heal the sick would be a sign identifying believers?
Mark 16:17, 18, KJ: "These signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; they shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
These verses appear in certain Bible manuscripts and versions of the fifth and sixth centuries C.E. But they do not appear in the older Greek manuscripts, the Sinaiticus and Vatican MS. 1209 of the fourth century. Dr. B. F. Westcott, an authority on Bible manuscripts, said that "the verses . . . are no part of the original narrative but an appendage." (An Introduction to the Study of the Gospels, London, 1881, p. 338) Bible translator Jerome, in the fifth century, said that "almost all the Greek codices [are] without this passage." (The Last Twelve Verses of the Gospel According to S. Mark, London, 1871, J. W. Burgon, p. 53) The New Catholic Encyclopedia (1967) says: "Its vocabulary and style differ so radically from the rest of the Gospel that it hardly seems possible Mark himself composed it [that is, verses 9-20]." (Vol. IX, p. 240) There is no record that early Christians either drank poison or handled serpents to prove they were believers.
Why were such gifts as the ability to do miraculous healing given to first-century Christians?
Heb. 2:3, 4: "How shall we escape if we have neglected a salvation of such greatness in that it began to be spoken through our Lord and was verified for us by those who heard him, while God joined in bearing witness with signs as well as portents and various powerful works and with distributions of holy spirit according to his will?" (Here was convincing evidence, indeed, that the Christian congregation, which was then new, was truly of God. But once that was fully established, would it be necessary to prove it again and again?)
1 Cor. 12:29, 30; 13:8, 13: "Not all are prophets, are they? . . . Not all have gifts of healings, do they? Not all speak in tongues, do they? . . . Love never fails. But whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease . . . Now, however, there remain faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love." (When they had accomplished their purpose, those miraculous gifts would cease. But priceless qualities that are the fruitage of God?s spirit would still be manifest in the lives of true Christians.)
Mark 16:17, 18, KJ: "These signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; they shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
These verses appear in certain Bible manuscripts and versions of the fifth and sixth centuries C.E. But they do not appear in the older Greek manuscripts, the Sinaiticus and Vatican MS. 1209 of the fourth century. Dr. B. F. Westcott, an authority on Bible manuscripts, said that "the verses . . . are no part of the original narrative but an appendage." (An Introduction to the Study of the Gospels, London, 1881, p. 338) Bible translator Jerome, in the fifth century, said that "almost all the Greek codices [are] without this passage." (The Last Twelve Verses of the Gospel According to S. Mark, London, 1871, J. W. Burgon, p. 53) The New Catholic Encyclopedia (1967) says: "Its vocabulary and style differ so radically from the rest of the Gospel that it hardly seems possible Mark himself composed it [that is, verses 9-20]." (Vol. IX, p. 240) There is no record that early Christians either drank poison or handled serpents to prove they were believers.
Why were such gifts as the ability to do miraculous healing given to first-century Christians?
Heb. 2:3, 4: "How shall we escape if we have neglected a salvation of such greatness in that it began to be spoken through our Lord and was verified for us by those who heard him, while God joined in bearing witness with signs as well as portents and various powerful works and with distributions of holy spirit according to his will?" (Here was convincing evidence, indeed, that the Christian congregation, which was then new, was truly of God. But once that was fully established, would it be necessary to prove it again and again?)
1 Cor. 12:29, 30; 13:8, 13: "Not all are prophets, are they? . . . Not all have gifts of healings, do they? Not all speak in tongues, do they? . . . Love never fails. But whether there are gifts of prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease . . . Now, however, there remain faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love." (When they had accomplished their purpose, those miraculous gifts would cease. But priceless qualities that are the fruitage of God?s spirit would still be manifest in the lives of true Christians.)
Plus, a true Christian looks forward to the new heaven and earth when Jehovah promises things like these.
THE BIBLE TEACHES THAT GOD WILL BRING ABOUT THESE CHANGES ON THE EARTH.
"He will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore."?Revelation 21:4
"The lame one will climb up just as a stag does."?Isaiah 35:6
"The eyes of the blind ones will be opened."?Isaiah 35:5
"All those in the memorial tombs will . . . come out."?John 5:28, 29
"No resident will say: ?I am sick.?"?Isaiah 33:24
"There will come to be plenty of grain on the earth."?Psalm 72:16
So this is the hope True Christians have based on the bible. These are not excuses. The reason why no other Christian organization can answer this correctly is because they don't believe people will live on earth forever. Which the bible clearly teaches will happen (psl 37:29)"The lame one will climb up just as a stag does."?Isaiah 35:6
"The eyes of the blind ones will be opened."?Isaiah 35:5
"All those in the memorial tombs will . . . come out."?John 5:28, 29
"No resident will say: ?I am sick.?"?Isaiah 33:24
"There will come to be plenty of grain on the earth."?Psalm 72:16
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
If this is true, help me out too. Why do you believe Jesus is God when he says he was created by God?
That would help me greatly in my quest for truth. It is the biggest reason why I believe what I do, because JW's have helped me to see that Jesus is not God.
I have been waiting for weeks for you to reply to our earlier conversation on this subject.
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
ABCD's youtube post response #2
Im combining questions 2, 5 and 6
2)why are there so many starving people in our world
5)Why is God such a proponent of slavery
6)why do bad things happen to good people.
5 is two fold here. One, Jehovah was not a proponent of Slavery. Mankind was responsible for that. Jehovah actually put laws into place that protected Hebrew slaves in a loving way because of this. The Jews had to obey these laws or face punishment themselves. Really Jehovah explains these in detail in exodus 22:2. Slaves even had to be let free after 6 years, and they were well taken care of. So this shows that Jehovah was not a proponent of slavery, as his laws provided care for slaves that bascially made them family members.
The next part of this helps put this point in perspective as well as the other 2 points.
Im combining questions 2, 5 and 6
2)why are there so many starving people in our world
5)Why is God such a proponent of slavery
6)why do bad things happen to good people.
5 is two fold here. One, Jehovah was not a proponent of Slavery. Mankind was responsible for that. Jehovah actually put laws into place that protected Hebrew slaves in a loving way because of this. The Jews had to obey these laws or face punishment themselves. Really Jehovah explains these in detail in exodus 22:2. Slaves even had to be let free after 6 years, and they were well taken care of. So this shows that Jehovah was not a proponent of slavery, as his laws provided care for slaves that bascially made them family members.
The next part of this helps put this point in perspective as well as the other 2 points.
WHY SO MUCH SUFFERING?
People of various religions have gone to their religious leaders and teachers to ask why there is so much suffering. Often, the response is that suffering is God?s will and that he long ago determined everything that would ever happen, including tragic events. Many are told that God?s ways are mysterious or that he brings death upon people?even children?so that he can have them in heaven with him. Jehovah God never causes what is bad. The Bible says: "Far be it from the true God to act wickedly, and the Almighty to act unjustly!"?Job 34:10.
Do you know why people make the mistake of blaming God for all the suffering in the world? In many cases, they blame Almighty God because they think that he is the real ruler of this world. They do not know a simple but important truth that the Bible teaches. The real ruler of this world is Satan the Devil.
The Bible clearly states: "The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one." (1 John 5:19) When you think about it, does that not make sense? This world reflects the personality of the invisible spirit creature who is "misleading the entire inhabited earth." (Revelation 12:9) Satan is hateful, deceptive, and cruel. So the world, under his influence, is full of hatred, deceit, and cruelty. That is one reason why there is so much suffering.
A second reason why there is so much suffering is that, mankind has been imperfect and sinful ever since the rebellion in the garden of Eden. Sinful humans tend to struggle for dominance, and this results in wars, oppression, and suffering. (Ecclesiastes 4:1; 8:9) A third reason for suffering is "time and unforeseen occurrence." (Ecclesiastes 9:11) In a world without Jehovah as a protective Ruler, people may suffer because they happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.
It is comforting for us to know that God does not cause suffering. He is not responsible for the wars, the crimes, the oppression, or even the natural disasters that cause people to suffer. Still, we need to know, Why does Jehovah allow all this suffering? If he is the Almighty, he has the power to stop it. Why, then, does he hold back? The loving God that we have come to know must have a good reason.?1 John 4:8.
Do you know why people make the mistake of blaming God for all the suffering in the world? In many cases, they blame Almighty God because they think that he is the real ruler of this world. They do not know a simple but important truth that the Bible teaches. The real ruler of this world is Satan the Devil.
The Bible clearly states: "The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one." (1 John 5:19) When you think about it, does that not make sense? This world reflects the personality of the invisible spirit creature who is "misleading the entire inhabited earth." (Revelation 12:9) Satan is hateful, deceptive, and cruel. So the world, under his influence, is full of hatred, deceit, and cruelty. That is one reason why there is so much suffering.
A second reason why there is so much suffering is that, mankind has been imperfect and sinful ever since the rebellion in the garden of Eden. Sinful humans tend to struggle for dominance, and this results in wars, oppression, and suffering. (Ecclesiastes 4:1; 8:9) A third reason for suffering is "time and unforeseen occurrence." (Ecclesiastes 9:11) In a world without Jehovah as a protective Ruler, people may suffer because they happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.
It is comforting for us to know that God does not cause suffering. He is not responsible for the wars, the crimes, the oppression, or even the natural disasters that cause people to suffer. Still, we need to know, Why does Jehovah allow all this suffering? If he is the Almighty, he has the power to stop it. Why, then, does he hold back? The loving God that we have come to know must have a good reason.?1 John 4:8.
A VITAL ISSUE IS RAISED
To find out why God allows suffering, we need to think back to the time when suffering began. When Satan led Adam and Eve into disobeying Jehovah, an important question was raised. Satan did not call into question Jehovah?s power. Even Satan knows that there is no limit to Jehovah?s power. Rather, Satan questioned Jehovah?s right to rule. By calling God a liar who withholds good from his subjects, Satan charged that Jehovah is a bad ruler. (Genesis 3:2-5) Satan implied that mankind would be better off without God?s rulership. This was an attack on Jehovah?s sovereignty, his right to rule.
To find out why God allows suffering, we need to think back to the time when suffering began. When Satan led Adam and Eve into disobeying Jehovah, an important question was raised. Satan did not call into question Jehovah?s power. Even Satan knows that there is no limit to Jehovah?s power. Rather, Satan questioned Jehovah?s right to rule. By calling God a liar who withholds good from his subjects, Satan charged that Jehovah is a bad ruler. (Genesis 3:2-5) Satan implied that mankind would be better off without God?s rulership. This was an attack on Jehovah?s sovereignty, his right to rule.
Adam and Eve rebelled against Jehovah. In effect, they said: "We do not need Jehovah as our Ruler. We can decide for ourselves what is right and what is wrong." How could Jehovah settle that issue? How could he teach all intelligent creatures that the rebels were wrong and that his way truly is best? Someone might say that God should simply have destroyed the rebels and made a fresh start. But Jehovah had stated his purpose to fill the earth with the offspring of Adam and Eve, and he wanted them to live in an earthly paradise. (Genesis 1:28) Jehovah always fulfills his purposes. (Isaiah 55:10, 11) Besides that, getting rid of the rebels in Eden would not have answered the question that had been raised regarding Jehovah?s right to rule.
Let us consider an illustration. Imagine that a teacher is telling his students how to solve a difficult problem. A clever but rebellious student claims that the teacher?s way of solving the problem is wrong. Implying that the teacher is not capable, this rebel insists that he knows a much better way to solve the problem. Some students think that he is right, and they also become rebellious. What should the teacher do? If he throws the rebels out of the class, what will be the effect on the other students? Will they not believe that their fellow student and those who joined him are right? All the other students in the class might lose respect for the teacher, thinking that he is afraid of being proved wrong. But suppose that the teacher allows the rebel to show the class how he would solve the problem.
Jehovah has done something similar to what the teacher does. Remember that the rebels in Eden were not the only ones involved. Millions of angels were watching. (Job 38:7; Daniel 7:10) How Jehovah handled the rebellion would greatly affect all those angels and eventually all intelligent creation. So, what has Jehovah done? He has allowed Satan to show how he would rule mankind. God has also allowed humans to govern themselves under Satan?s guidance.
The teacher in our illustration knows that the rebel and the students on his side are wrong. But he also knows that allowing them the opportunity to try to prove their point will benefit the whole class. When the rebels fail, all honest students will see that the teacher is the only one qualified to lead the class. They will understand why the teacher thereafter removes any rebels from the class. Similarly, Jehovah knows that all honesthearted humans and angels will benefit from seeing that Satan and his fellow rebels have failed and that humans cannot govern themselves. Like Jeremiah of old, they will learn this vital truth: "I well know, O Jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step."?Jeremiah 10:23.
Let us consider an illustration. Imagine that a teacher is telling his students how to solve a difficult problem. A clever but rebellious student claims that the teacher?s way of solving the problem is wrong. Implying that the teacher is not capable, this rebel insists that he knows a much better way to solve the problem. Some students think that he is right, and they also become rebellious. What should the teacher do? If he throws the rebels out of the class, what will be the effect on the other students? Will they not believe that their fellow student and those who joined him are right? All the other students in the class might lose respect for the teacher, thinking that he is afraid of being proved wrong. But suppose that the teacher allows the rebel to show the class how he would solve the problem.
Jehovah has done something similar to what the teacher does. Remember that the rebels in Eden were not the only ones involved. Millions of angels were watching. (Job 38:7; Daniel 7:10) How Jehovah handled the rebellion would greatly affect all those angels and eventually all intelligent creation. So, what has Jehovah done? He has allowed Satan to show how he would rule mankind. God has also allowed humans to govern themselves under Satan?s guidance.
The teacher in our illustration knows that the rebel and the students on his side are wrong. But he also knows that allowing them the opportunity to try to prove their point will benefit the whole class. When the rebels fail, all honest students will see that the teacher is the only one qualified to lead the class. They will understand why the teacher thereafter removes any rebels from the class. Similarly, Jehovah knows that all honesthearted humans and angels will benefit from seeing that Satan and his fellow rebels have failed and that humans cannot govern themselves. Like Jeremiah of old, they will learn this vital truth: "I well know, O Jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step."?Jeremiah 10:23.
WHY SO LONG?
Why, though, has Jehovah allowed suffering to go on for so long? And why does he not prevent bad things from happening? Well, consider two things that the teacher in our illustration would not do. First, he would not stop the rebel student from presenting his case. Second, the teacher would not help the rebel to make his case. Similarly, consider two things that Jehovah has determined not to do. First, he has not stopped Satan and those who side with him from trying to prove that they are right. Allowing time to pass has thus been necessary. In the thousands of years of human history, mankind has been able to try every form of self-rule, or human government. Mankind has made some advances in science and other fields, but injustice, poverty, crime, and war have grown ever worse. Human rule has now been shown to be a failure.
Second, Jehovah has not helped Satan to rule this world. If God were to prevent horrible crimes, for instance, would he not, in effect, be supporting the case of the rebels? Would God not be making people think that perhaps humans can govern themselves without disastrous results? If Jehovah were to act in that way, he would become party to a lie. However, "it is impossible for God to lie."?Hebrews 6:18.
What, though, about all the harm that has been done during the long rebellion against God? We do well to remember that Jehovah is almighty. Therefore, he can and will undo the effects of mankind?s suffering. As we have already learned, the ruining of our planet will be undone by the turning of the earth into Paradise. The effects of sin will be removed through faith in Jesus? ransom sacrifice, and the effects of death will be reversed by means of the resurrection. God will thus use Jesus "to break up the works of the Devil." (1 John 3:8) Jehovah will bring all of this about at just the right time. We can be glad that he has not acted sooner, for his patience has given us the opportunity to learn the truth and to serve him. (2 Peter 3:9, 10) Meanwhile, God has been actively seeking sincere worshipers and helping them to endure any suffering that may come upon them in this troubled world.?John 4:23; 1 Corinthians 10:13.
I will adress the others soon.
Second, Jehovah has not helped Satan to rule this world. If God were to prevent horrible crimes, for instance, would he not, in effect, be supporting the case of the rebels? Would God not be making people think that perhaps humans can govern themselves without disastrous results? If Jehovah were to act in that way, he would become party to a lie. However, "it is impossible for God to lie."?Hebrews 6:18.
What, though, about all the harm that has been done during the long rebellion against God? We do well to remember that Jehovah is almighty. Therefore, he can and will undo the effects of mankind?s suffering. As we have already learned, the ruining of our planet will be undone by the turning of the earth into Paradise. The effects of sin will be removed through faith in Jesus? ransom sacrifice, and the effects of death will be reversed by means of the resurrection. God will thus use Jesus "to break up the works of the Devil." (1 John 3:8) Jehovah will bring all of this about at just the right time. We can be glad that he has not acted sooner, for his patience has given us the opportunity to learn the truth and to serve him. (2 Peter 3:9, 10) Meanwhile, God has been actively seeking sincere worshipers and helping them to endure any suffering that may come upon them in this troubled world.?John 4:23; 1 Corinthians 10:13.
I will adress the others soon.
Weeks ago I did not answer you because i took a rest from the debates about Christianity and focused more on the Knicks because this is a Knicks forum. I will continue our argument if you like. And I will answer your question or questions in due time.
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
Well you charge is a pretty serious charge. That JW's have been known to twist the bible. So there are a few issues I'd like to get cleared up, since basically you're saying I and 7 million others are party to lies concerning the bible.
We can start with Is Jesus Almighty God? Based on extensive... and I mean Extensive study of this, I'd have to say no. But maybe You have information that could change this opinion.
No rush, reply when you can.
Knicks4lyfe, you know you like to twist the Bible. Just admit it.
That's why you don't change the part of the Bible that says "thou shalt not steal", but you change the part that says " 44Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.
45Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession. 46And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour", by ignoring it, using other parts of the Bible that don't have anything to do with the topic, or saying no, because it makes you upset.
It's like a little game for you. Whenever you like something that's in the Bible, you leave it alone. Whenever there's something controversial in the Bible, you ignore it, change it, or use separate quotes from the Bible that have nothing to do with the topic. Have fun.
That's why you don't change the part of the Bible that says "thou shalt not steal", but you change the part that says " 44Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.
45Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession. 46And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour", by ignoring it, using other parts of the Bible that don't have anything to do with the topic, or saying no, because it makes you upset.
It's like a little game for you. Whenever you like something that's in the Bible, you leave it alone. Whenever there's something controversial in the Bible, you ignore it, change it, or use separate quotes from the Bible that have nothing to do with the topic. Have fun.
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
Really, this is the bottom line.
The bible has a theme. One theme, not 50. 1. And that is the Vindication of Jehovah's sovereignty through his heavenly Kingdom, spearheaded by his Son Christ Jesus.
If you really understood that, you would have a much easier time understanding the bible. No twisting involved, it's just plain ole truth.
It appears you just want the bible to have flaws... But we don't always get what we wish.
It appears that you want to believe the Bible is 100% accurate, but we don't always get what we wish.
Bible Map
World Map
Judges 1:19
"Now the LORD was with Judah, and they took possession of the hill country; but they could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley because they had iron chariots."
There's nothing wrong with that. God is the supreme being, gets defeated with iron chariots, but there's nothing wrong with that.
Knicks4lyfe has the perfect manipulation of the Bible, to ignore quotes that are in the Bible.
"Now the LORD was with Judah, and they took possession of the hill country; but they could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley because they had iron chariots."
There's nothing wrong with that. God is the supreme being, gets defeated with iron chariots, but there's nothing wrong with that.
Knicks4lyfe has the perfect manipulation of the Bible, to ignore quotes that are in the Bible.
TunerAddict
Starter
I know. You have to be able to tell when the Bible is literal, and when it's metaphorical. lol
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
I wonder can you really be speaking metaphorically in the Matrix? Can we prove it?
Knicks4lyfe
Starter
20 When they gave Ca´leb He´bron, just as Moses had promised, then he drove out from there the three sons of A´nak.
So they completed their purpose. So how did Jehovah lose, when his purpose was completed?
Because it says that "they could not drive out the inhabitants, because they had iron chariots."
God is supposed to be perfect. How can he not drive out the inhabitants?
Most 3rd world countries could take out another nation that tried to use iron chariots to defeat them, yet God can't defeat them?
You are the king of spin, my friend. You took the part of the quote that said God took possession of the hill country, BUT YOU IGNORE THE PART THAT SAYS GOD COULD NOT DRIVE OUT THE INHABITANTS, BECAUSE THEY HAD IRON CHARIOTS.
IF GOD IS PERFECT, HE SHOULD BE ABLE TO DEFEAT SOMEONE ON AN IRON CHARIOT.
Also, you only responded to part of my post. Please explain why, if God created the ENTIRE EARTH, the map of the Bible shows only a mere 40% of the Earth?
P.S. Look what I found, guys. The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures version of Judges 1:19.
http://www.watchtower.org/bible/jg/chapter_001.htm
"And Jehovah continued with Judah, so that he took possession of the mountainous region, but he could not dispossess the inhabitants of the low plain, because they had war chariots with iron scythes."
In other words, Jehovah and Judah took over the people that lived in the mountains, but they lost to the people in the low plains, due to their "deadly" iron chariots that are capable of stopping a "supreme" and "perfect" being.
That makes total sense, doesn't it? :td:
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Knicks4lyfe
Starter
Paul as well as myself have explained your weak argument about 40 of the world in the bible. Pay more attention. That's what people do when they have questions, listen for answers. Go a few pages back and find it.
And clearly God did not lose because his purpose in helping Judah was fulfilled. This is a trivial argument you are trying to pose against the bible.
You're really better off just saying you don't wanna do God's will.
I can't be respectful, when I make this post. Get the hell out of my face with that bulls#it!
My argument of why NORTH AMERICA, SOUTH AMERICA, AUSTRALIA, ANTARCTICA, HALF OF AFRICA, HALF OF EUROPE, HALF OF ASIA, THE PACIFIC OCEAN, AND THE ATLANTIC OCEAN are missing from the Bible is weak?
Please grow a brain, because only someone without a brain would find the
"creator of the Earth" excluding 60% of the world logical.
Bottom line is, no matter how much you spin it, God was helping Judah fight the inhabitants of the mountains and the plains. If God is the supreme and perfect being, why can't he move the people of the plains?
Iron Chariots are now this unstoppable force that nothing can defeat?
Please read a history textbook, and please use some logic.
It is obvious that you don't read the Bible, without first using the Watchtower and Awake! magazine that corrupts and changes the Bible. That's why you have this big defense and twisting mechanism for whenever something in the Bible makes no sense, or is just illogical.